Author Topic: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism  (Read 8678 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline 8ullfrog

  • Homo Superior
  • ******
  • Posts: 3248
I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« on: January 18, 2014, 09:56:11 PM »
In the Day-z thread I was asked about what I think of these survival games. They scare the bless'ed poo out of me.

I've played ARMA II with some military buddies, and it seemed pretty legit. Not just from a tech/effect standpoint, but the experience. I'll be driving, as I do in real life when we hang out. I've got a buddy who is an AWESOME pilot, but he can't drive for poo. I drive extremely safely, and it is appreciated. So it is in ARMA II. My buddy does the flying, I do the driving. We were being hunted by tanks, and eventually a mortar punched through the engine block, so we bailed into the dark. And holy poo was it dark. Not "oh, I'll turn up the contrast dark" but Dark-o-bless'ed clock. We had kitted out with NVG's because it was a night mission, but without those goggles, we could not see. We moved slowly, taking out the enemy tanks and slowly running out of ammo. After we beat the mission the server was still live, so we hung out by the burning tanks looking out into the dark, then we walked back to base.

Apparently that isn't what is done in the newer breed of "survivalism" gaming. In DayZ and Rust, teamwork is a thing of the past. It's libertarianism at it's sharpest, and it's an absolute nightmare. Yeah, "It's just a game" but I think it really says something about you if you handcuff a man to a pipe and feed him drain cleaner.

I have long held the belief that equating video game violence with real world violence is a fallacy, but I really do think this is the libertarian endgame. Beating people to death over a can of beans.

And that is what scares me.

Offline tarascon

  • Cro-Magnon
  • ****
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
  • Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2014, 08:26:58 AM »
In the Day-z thread I was asked about what I think of these survival games. They scare the bless'ed poo out of me.

[...]

Apparently that isn't what is done in the newer breed of "survivalism" gaming. In DayZ and Rust, teamwork is a thing of the past. It's libertarianism at it's sharpest, and it's an absolute nightmare. Yeah, "It's just a game" but I think it really says something about you if you handcuff a man to a pipe and feed him drain cleaner.

I have long held the belief that equating video game violence with real world violence is a fallacy, but I really do think this is the libertarian endgame. Beating people to death over a can of beans.

And that is what scares me.

  Firstly, I want to say that you could have hijacked the DayZ thread 8ullfrog since your post is pertinent to an issue I raised there but I thank you for your consideration.  :)
  Secondly, that sort of over the top cruelty in a game disturbs me greatly. It says a lot about a particular kind of behavior which seems to be spreading in RL and leaking insidiously into the game world. We're becoming like rats in a barrel. (Not to be speaking ill of rats.) Do you recall the news--years ago--about online rape in some of the virtual sex games (I don't know what they're called--the digital sex sites). And saying it's "only a game" is like excusing a child who tortures the family pet by saying they will grow out of it; I'm sure that sooner or later these sociopathic personalities will find the virtual experience unsatisfying and their malfunctions will spill over into RL.
  Which brings up the comments I've read on the game fora (in this case, the DayZ fora). In response to similar complaints there about "certain behaviors" in game, I've read some posters who said that all is fair in a survivor game--that in an apocalypse people do what they need to do to live. That surviving means making unethical moral choices even at the cost of one's humanity. This is an extremely lame excuse. This means that the enemy has already won. This is the point in programs like The Walking Dead. Randomly killing newbs for sport... since these players have nothing to loot, or chaining them to some pipes, etc, is pathological behavior pure and simple and puts the troll back into trolling. This sort of thing also helps the folks who claim that the violence in computer or console games will create violent people. Perhaps, being what humans are capable of being at their worst, it's regrettable to have any violence in game-play but most game violence is contextual and, yes, an effective way of winning a particular game. It is not conducive towards dehumanization, in my opinion. In an MMO like Arma or DayZ the level of violence, preying, and cruelty is brought into the game by some unhinged person and played out in lieu of acting that way in RL. The DayZ fora had a post which said that stalking such a person (who'd murdered an earlier avatar of theirs) and paying them back in kind was acceptable. There was no talk of finding and tormenting the player--just exacting payback by killing them. I tend to agree with the poster who made that point; reducing such a player back to newb level is the best way to send the message that such behavior will not be tolerated. It's a shame they cannot be removed entirely from the game world and, perhaps, when the MMO gets further developed, the GM's will have the power/capability to deny "so-and-so" from joining any server. That would be the sweetest revenge of all.

  Oh, I want to add one more comment--about Arma specifically--I heard that the game is so realistic and so tough that some players never even got out of boot camp. You must be at a pretty high level, 8ully, to manage destroying tanks. I salute you, Sir.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2014, 09:27:40 AM by tarascon »
Estragon: I can't go on like this.
Vladimir: That's what you think.

Offline 8ullfrog

  • Homo Superior
  • ******
  • Posts: 3248
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2014, 11:24:59 PM »
You can bypass boot, it's got some problems. I actually can't run most of the single player experience, but I can access the multi sometimes. My laptop isn't really the best for gaming.


You can run into gaming assholes like this in any PVP scenario though. In STO they made a big push to get players involved in PVP with rewards. They even sent in devs to run a training camp for PVP. Still, a lot of people avoid it because it is populated with some of the shittiest people you can run into online. Compare that to the PVE scene - the STF missions require five players. I've found a great channel that matches you with helpful and cooperative people. It's night and day compared to the bottom warzones.

I wasn't the tank killer. I was the driver and later on, spotter.

Offline tarascon

  • Cro-Magnon
  • ****
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
  • Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2014, 07:09:07 AM »
>> Do you want this thread to focus on MMO behavior or can we include "regular" games?

In GTA V there's a distasteful scene which they could have left out by getting the information another way. I realize that Rock Star was making a social comment about state and personal behavior but still...

Spoiler (hover to show)
Estragon: I can't go on like this.
Vladimir: That's what you think.

Offline 8ullfrog

  • Homo Superior
  • ******
  • Posts: 3248
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2014, 02:10:44 PM »
There was a scene like that in IV as well, with the roles reversed.

I'm pretty sure the discomfort those scenes provoked were intentional, to show that it is in fact a brutal, and ultimately pointless act.

I still have not purchased or played Spec Ops: The line, but I hear that the entire game is set up in this way.

Offline tarascon

  • Cro-Magnon
  • ****
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
  • Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2014, 05:55:16 AM »
Mark my words, one day we'll have a game called "Serial Killer" or something like that.
Wasn't there a character on Dexter that was creating one--or was that a website?
Estragon: I can't go on like this.
Vladimir: That's what you think.

Offline 8ullfrog

  • Homo Superior
  • ******
  • Posts: 3248
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2014, 06:14:28 AM »
Manhunt was on the PS2, and there are many other straight up murder people games.

poo, I very much enjoy the hitman series, and that's about a contract killer who was literally bred for his job.

Offline tarascon

  • Cro-Magnon
  • ****
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
  • Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2014, 06:27:02 AM »
Never heard of Manhunt.
Yeah, Hitman was fun. I regret tossing the games years ago when I realized I was addicted. Even today, gaming seriously cuts into my reading/writing time. I lose track of the time--tell myself I'll play for an hour or two and before I know it four + hours are gone. Poof!

But I don't consider Hitman, for example, a game that's over-the-top violent. I really liked the stealth aspect of the game play.
Estragon: I can't go on like this.
Vladimir: That's what you think.

Offline 8ullfrog

  • Homo Superior
  • ******
  • Posts: 3248
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2014, 11:06:15 AM »
You start manhunt unarmed, in the detroit like "Carcer city". You have to scavenge weaponry from poo off the ground.

For example, lets say you find a broken window. That's a shard of glass. Deadly enough on it's own, but combine it with a plastic shopping bag.

You wrap the plastic bag around the face of one of the murder gang members, and pull back. When his neck is pulled back you ram the shard of glass into his throat.

This execution rewards "style points".

[Turns out I was wrong about the bag glass combo. I was just mixing up two different execution methods. I also found out that timing impacts the severity of the kill. I also forgot that these executions are presented as snuff films.]

Also, several minutes after I made the last post, steam told me that the Hitman games are all on sale.

http://store.steampowered.com/sub/26687/

That is a weird bless'ed coincidence.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2014, 02:05:15 PM by 8ullfrog »

Offline tarascon

  • Cro-Magnon
  • ****
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
  • Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Re: I got my violence In hi-def ultra-realism
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2014, 06:26:59 AM »
Steam must send "guests" to our site.  ;D
Estragon: I can't go on like this.
Vladimir: That's what you think.